Posted by ken in sc on June 22, 2005 at 14:46:49:
JohnBoy-
First, I am on your side in this thread. For further explanation to others, isn’t it true that the title company has the seller sign a document at closing saying there are no outstanding bills owed or contracts. If the seller signs this form at closing, then the title company insures the property’s title, and would sue the seller themselves when they have to pay a claim.
Ken
Recording a Contract - Posted by Rob C.
Posted by Rob C. on June 22, 2005 at 10:09:56:
Is it important to record a contract after it has been signed by you and the seller? If so, how do I do this?
Thanks!
Much Success!
Rob C. from Baltimore
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Re: Recording a Contract - Posted by Mike (Seattle WA)
Posted by Mike (Seattle WA) on June 22, 2005 at 15:10:06:
Or you can not do it and lose a good deal like I did a month back. Seller in BK, I’m ready to buy their house after a SS. All is go, then they won’t call me back anymore. Huh? Turns out another investor had swooped in, signed a new contract. Do I sue the BK sellers? Hardly. The other investor? Not over the amount I lost - not worth my time. Yet, if I had had the Notice of Memorandum and/or contract recoreded, he wouldn’t have been able to do squat.
Re: Recording a Contract - Posted by Phil
Posted by Phil on June 22, 2005 at 13:44:05:
I agree with Johnboy. While, according to William Bronchick, he says its not a legal requirement that you record your contract, its just plain dumb not too. WHy not pay the recording fee and protect your interests. This way the property is YOURS, period.
Re: Recording a Contract - Posted by JohnBoy
Posted by JohnBoy on June 22, 2005 at 12:39:08:
You go to the county courthouse in the county the property is located and go the recorder’s office and they will record it. It should also be notarized.
Re: Recording a Contract - Posted by Don Dion
Posted by Don Dion on June 22, 2005 at 11:34:38:
No there is no reason to record a contract since there is no title transfer. Recording is for public notice of title transfers.
WRONG! - Posted by JohnBoy
Posted by JohnBoy on June 22, 2005 at 12:37:13:
No, there is every reason to record your contract! Transfer of title has nothing to do with it!
What if the seller sells it to someone else? You have no more house! What if the seller goes down and borrows against the property sucking all the equity plus some out of the property and can’t pay it back? You are screwed!
Recording your contract prevents things like that from happening. The bank won’t loan money without you signing a subordination agreement to their new loan if they see you have a contract on the house. If it’s not recorded they wouldn’t know about your contract and you lose your position in the property. A title company won’t close or insure title if they see you have a contract recorded without you signing a release.
So yes, you should always record your contracts!
Re: WRONG! - Posted by Don Dion
Posted by Don Dion on June 22, 2005 at 12:56:43:
Hmmm were did you get your law degree? I would suggest you take a feild trip down to your local county recorders office and go on the tour. It will open your eyes to the recording process and what it does and does not do.
If the seller sell’s the home to someone else and you have a contract see your attorney and file suit for specific performance. You can record any document but as you will find out when you go on your tour. All you gain by recording is public notice - nothing more.
Re: WRONG! - Posted by JohnBoy
Posted by JohnBoy on June 22, 2005 at 13:09:31:
Public notice on a purchase agreement. A land contract secures your position in the property. Not recording it gives you no protection at all. Zip! Nothing!
If the seller sold to someone else you won’t get any specific performance. It will be to late for that. He would have already SOLD the property. Someone else will already own it! Period!
The only thing you could do is sue the seller, but what good is that going to do if the seller has nothing to sue for???
All the field trips in the world isn’t going to provide you with legal advice on how the laws pertain to recording documents at the court house. Go take a field trip to a local real estate attorney’s office and educate yourself.
What do you think the point of public notice is for??? With no notice of anything showing you have an interest in the property leaves you wide open to risk. That is the point of recording things. That public notice is what protects your interest in the property.
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Re: WRONG! - Posted by Don Dion
Posted by Don Dion on June 22, 2005 at 15:19:04:
I dont wish to argue the point with you. I strongly suggest you take the tour of your local recording office and have the experts tell you what recording does and does not do.
You seem to be way off base here. I am not even sure if you can record anything against someone elses property. I know that if you have a service contract you can record a mechanics lein on the property but even that is only good for a short period of time an you have to take step number to an bring suit in order to get a judgement which then can be recorded. In your case you have no legal interest in the property until the day of your closing.
It seems like the other people which are making comments here agree with me you have no standing in this issue.
Re: WRONG! - Posted by steve
Posted by steve on June 22, 2005 at 13:44:53:
many contracts forbid recording in the contract language. further you can record anything, but what effect it will have on TITLE is the question??? i would not record unless the seller was trying to back out. but just recording does not create a lien or judgment against title, and depending on who is doing the title exam, may or may not create an issue to giving clear title.
Get YOUR OWN attorneys opinion first.
everyone with a law degree stand up.
Re: WRONG! - Posted by nick
Posted by nick on June 22, 2005 at 13:36:17:
Do any of you even read your sales contracts. There is no need to record it. You are wasting time and money. The contract should specifically state what happens in the event that the seller does not perform. If its not speak to your attorney and have a clause added before you sign.
And dont forget that even if you do record your contract it wont show up in public records that day so a search of the property may not reveal it for months. The seller may still sell during that time it doesnt show up and then what. Whats your recourse then. The same as if you didnt record it, you sue for breach of contract.
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Re: WRONG! - Posted by Phil
Posted by Phil on June 22, 2005 at 18:14:07:
Don, liking your wounds? Johnboy is a senior poster on Cre, he’ been posting here for years and years. Plus he’s been doing this stuff before most od us could walk. He posts from knolwdge, experience and fact or I don’t think he will post on a subject.
Re: WRONG! - Posted by JohnBoy
Posted by JohnBoy on June 22, 2005 at 15:50:29:
The employees at the court house are not the experts. So going there for advice is not going to help you. If you want advice from the experts you need to go see a qualified attorney for that. Not some $7 per hour employee working in the recorders office! They are not allowed to give any legal advice anyway even if they knew anything.
Anything that gives you any interest in a property you can record. A purchase contract gives you an interest. A land contract gives you an interest. A lease/option gives you an interest. A lease gives you an interest. A trust deed gives you an interest. A mortgage gives you an interest. And many other things that would give you an interest. All of these things would allow you to record that interest.
If I have a contract on a property I have an interest in that property until I close or until the contract expires, whichever comes first. If I have a contract to buy for say, $50k and the property is worth $80k, then I have a $30k interest in that property. My contract gives me the legal right to buy the property. By having that contract to buy the property for $50k, that $30k of equity becomes my interest. If the seller sells it to someone else I have grounds to sue for the amount of damages I suffered as a result of it. My damages would be the $30k interest I had in my contract. The seller would have breached his contract with me. If I recorded that contract and a title company insured title on that property my recorded contract would allow me to file a claim against the title company for the amount of the equity I lost because of them ignoring my contract and insuring title around it. So in all likelihood the title company would not close without me signing a release on my recorded contract first.
It seems most of the other posters here do not agree with you. Go back and read the posts again. You do not know what you are talking about and you are the one way off base here.
You said: “I am not even sure if you can record anything against someone elses property”
That alone shows you don’t know what you are talking about. Suggesting to go to the courthouse to talk to the experts shows you don’t know what you are talking about. Those people are not the experts when it comes to any legal standing on recording something. You go to your attorney’s office to get expert advice for that stuff. Not the courthouse.
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Re: WRONG! - Posted by Nike
Posted by Nike on June 22, 2005 at 14:09:54:
But you would record if the seller was backing out? Why? If then, why not initially?
I have never recorded a contract and I don’t think it’s necessary as Ive never had a problem but you’re missong the point—recording the contract puts the world on notice that there is a contract–that a third party has an equitable interest in the property. Any subsequent buyer will be on notice (constructive notice if not actual notice) and therefore they will not be a bona fide purchaser.
Re: WRONG! - Posted by JohnBoy
Posted by JohnBoy on June 22, 2005 at 13:57:13:
And while many contracts forbid recording, some states prohibit having that clause in a contract. My state being one of them. In fact, if you put such a clause in a contract that prohibits the buyer from recording, then the contract is voidable at the option of the buyer. And recording it anyway leaves the seller with no recourse for doing so despite the fact the contract says it was prohibited.
The effect it has on title is if we are talking about a purchase contract, it clouds title. If a title company closes around it you would not only have recourse against the seller, but the title company as well.