Posted by $Cash$ (NV) on October 31, 2002 at 11:15:26:
Len,
It was Mr. Bill Bronchick, however it was just ‘two guys’ (not Gurus’s, except he really is one) talking about real estate investing, the ‘hold’ or what the percentages the casino’s make off different games which I knew about because of my casino background, just an enjoyable chat about different things, nothing more nothing less.
John $Cash$ Locke
How do you become a “people person”? - Posted by NJ989
Posted by NJ989 on October 30, 2002 at 17:12:42:
A long time ago (well, maybe not that long ago) people like us who were trying to become entrepreneurs and business-people read “How to Make Friends and Influence People” or attended Toastmasters or read works by Zig Ziglar.
To the point: in working on my own growth, I find the numbers and the deal concepts easy compared to the face-to-face part. It’s not that I’m a schlub; in my non-real-estate career I’ve negotiated many a deal and many a contract (high tech-related). I’m good in a “conference room” setting or on a teleconference with lawyers and executives; but I’m not a natural salesman and I’m finding it tough going dealing with the “just folks” who are often on the other end of a REI transaction.
I was reading the transcript from an online chat the other day, and the guest star was obviously a people person – though not a grammar person or a spelling person, they were getting deals done. I’d trade my ability to write a sentence in a contract for that person’s people skills any day.
What’s the state of the art in books or seminars on this topic? What’s the Toastmasters or “How to Win Friends” for the 2000s? Who has recently gotten better at this important skill, that can share a success story?
Re: How do you become a “people person”? - Posted by NJ989
Posted by NJ989 on November 07, 2002 at 16:03:56:
Thanks, everyone, for the great recommendations!
Re: How do you become a “people person”? - Posted by Bryan-SactoCA
Posted by Bryan-SactoCA on October 31, 2002 at 11:00:56:
I think that you actually want to know how to sell. I think the best book for that is How to Master the Art of Selling by Tom Hopkins. One of his ideas is when you go on a “sales call” (like going to meet a motivated seler) that you should actually write down what you’re going to say and do during your presentation and practice it and commit it to memory so you aren’t winging it. Hopkins says that those salespeople who think they’re “naturals” and who speak off the cuff don’t make many sales.
Re: How do you become a “people person”? - Posted by eric-fl
Posted by eric-fl on October 31, 2002 at 10:49:05:
My thoughts on this:
For one, if you just simply want to make people like you, “How to Win Friends & Influence People” is still about the best you can read on the subject. Human nature has not fundamentally changed since it was written, although the books’ advice is much harder to follow than it is to learn.
I don’t really like Zig. Too “salesy”. Zig would not have sold me a pot, had I walked into his store. He’s too friendly, too cheery, too positive. I value sincerity & knowledge over cheerfullness, and like to feel like I’ve made my own purchasing decision (whether I really have or not.) In this camp, I think Tom Hopkins is a better way to go. He just comes off more as a sales professional than a wheeler dealer.
However, all of the above is old school. Good fundamentals, but not enough tricks for an “edge junkie” like me.
The “state of the art” (which, by the way, is a phrase an edge junkie would use, FYI) in selling, is to stop selling. No one likes to be “sold” anyway, and it’s really not your ultimate goal. The ultimate goal is to make someone do something you want them do to. This is typically called influence or persuasion, and I believe you will find much more useful information of the type you are looking for under this heading.
To start with, the classic text on this is “Influence”, by Robert Cialdini. He is a professor who conducted many active studies by sending out people to do things like, get reservations at popular restaurants without notice, get change from people to make a phone call, cut ahead in line at the photocopier, you get the idea. He distilled the seven primary influence “triggers”, and enumerated them in this book. There have been many other books since which have expanded on this theme.
Another area to look at is Neuro-Linguistic Programming, or NLP. This is a branch of psychology founded by Bandler & Grinder, themselves therapists, based on much research and practice. It was popularized in the 80’s by Anthony Robbins. Robbins added a lot of fluff to NLP as well. Bandler & Grinders books are mostly written like technical treatises, so probably not the best introductions to the subject. The main idea behind NLP is to proceed from a basis of how the mind works, based on practical observations. It incorporates things you may have heard of, such as anchoring, embedded suggestion, pacing & leading, etc. Much of it is useful in selling & negotiating situations. Kenrick Cleveland is a “guru” type who sells courses in NLP, I have heard good things about his materials. IMO, the best way to learn NLP, however, is through seminars. It’s a lot to take in, and you have to practice it to incorporate it.
A lot of NLP’ers also get into conversational hypnosis, founded by Milton Erickson (you’re REALLY going to like… this idea…as you are hearing me talk about it…and taking it into your mind… and so on). I personally think this area is cheesy, but a lot of people swear it works. I also happen to think it does not apply well in real estate situations, but I won’t get in to why, since this is already such a long post.
Anyway, there’s probably enough information to get you a master’s degree in the subject of influence & persuasion, if that’s what you want to do. Your main task in this is to separate the wheat from the chaff, I’m not aware of any creonline-like site in this area that has already done it for you, unfortunately.
Re: How do you become a “people person”? - Posted by lil (CT future PA)
Posted by lil (CT future PA) on October 31, 2002 at 07:49:58:
Your smile. It’s the biggest ice breaker in any situation.
Try it, it’s contagious. See how many people smile back at you and will even add some small conversation.
With people, that’s how. - Posted by js-Indianapolis
Posted by js-Indianapolis on October 31, 2002 at 03:04:17:
NJ-
I’d suggest to get out there. In my previous businesses, I was a member of BNI, Business Networking International. You should find a local chapter, they’re everywhere. Once a week you do breakfast or lunch with a group of businesspeople. Socialize, then do a two minute pitch for what leads you are looking for, during that week. Also, every week a member does a 15 minute presentation on their business. Networking, socializing, and selling, all in an hour and a half a week.
I also am a member of the Junior Chamber of Commerce. If you are under 40, you can become a member. Great organization for getting to know people. If you’re not at that age, the Chamber has monthly “Business after Hours” meetings you can attend. You should be able to hone your people skills as well as meet some great contacts for your business.
And what Cash said, about talking with anyone and everyone. That is the quickest, easiest way. I don’t care who it is, if they’re within earshot of me, they’re at least hearing “Howdy”. And knowing me, a lot more chit chat. Think it’ll be embarrassing? who cares? You’ll probably see that person once in your life, and they’ll have a funny story about some “dork that tried to talk to them” today. I’d look at it as entertaining someone for the day. God knows I’ve entertained a few people, not by choice.
Now, to be more specific to your question, I have had some recent success. I have been paying attention to the seasoned investors here, and keep hearing one reoccurring theme. “How can I help you?” I might even make this my business slogan. It’s the one thing I know when I’m talking with a seller. In fact, it’s just about the only thing I know. All I do is ask what they need, or listen for when they tell me what they need.
For instance, my “BIG” success story. I contacted a person last week, who is in foreclosure. His initial reaction was, in a nutshell, “Don’t care, don’t care, don’t care.”
He told me he didn’t care, he knows his credit is ruined. I told him I can help with his credit.
He said also that he had “written it off” in his mind, and was just waiting for it to be it over. I can help make it go away fast.
He didn’t think that he was going to get any money out of it. I said I could help him with that.
Was I selling? Nope, just thinking what I can do to help this guy out, make his troubles and pain go away.
Now did I sell him? Absolutely. He’s so sold on not ruining his credit, and selling this thing soon, and making a buck, he’s decided to figure out the payoff, and try to get it sold…but now, on his own. Crap! This is the guy that a week ago did not care about any of it. I guess I might have “helped” him a little too much. But I know that he will find that the bank will not play ball with him, the leinholders will not go away. Then the last thing he said in our conversation was that he was real busy, and didn’t know when he’d be able to talk to the bank. My response? If you want me to take care of that too, I can help. Eventually, he will be left with one option. That I can help.
alternate ego - Posted by Tray Giddens, Houston
Posted by Tray Giddens, Houston on October 30, 2002 at 21:53:11:
i used to be very shy… didn’t talk to strangers and generally didn’t know how to communicate socially.
one day i decided to make up an alternate ego for sales. i Called this personna “Tumbleweed Tray Giddens”
i would set my frame of mind when setting up an open house or getting ready to meet people. Tumbleweed was going to be one of "those guys " that talks to people about anything. “tumbleweed” has something that other people desire and really wants to get his message out.
that was about 6 years ago. now the tumbleweed and tray have merged into an easy going ,easy to talk with individual for all occasions… sometimes i crank up the full blown tumbleweed for business. it’s as easy as flipping a switch. tumbleweed is a shark, a wheeler dealer, an exquisite dresser and won’t take no for an answer…
that trick worked for me, i’m doing deals when i want, in the manner i like.
it’s all about confidence. all those books and tapes out there are nothing more than confidence builders…
regular old tray would listen and read those materials , but didn’t have the guts to implement them.
make up an alter ego, it’s fun!!! it’s your brain, play with it.
Tray Giddens,Realtor
www.hudsandvas.com
Houston,TX
Re: How do you become a “people person”? - Posted by michaela-ATL
Posted by michaela-ATL on October 30, 2002 at 21:20:24:
i’ve never been a ‘people person’ or what people seem to think of what a people person is. i’m a loner. will prefer a book or game of chess to crowd of people most of the time. i fell into the sales end in my previous life as a freight forwarder. had no background in sales, but tons in operations as a freight forwarder. i did very, very well. why? because , as $cash$ mentioned, i believed in what i was selling. i knew exactly what could and couldn’t be done. i was sincere with everything i told people. i never had a script, even with big accounts. i went in there, asked questions and custom tailored a solution to their problem on the spot. i meant every word i said, it was not an act.
i do the same thing now. i stand behind what i promise and i don’t promise what i can’t deliver. people pick up on that. they will know if you’re playing a game or if you’re sincere. talk to the person, not to the owner of the house, that you’d like to ‘steal’. listen! i care about the people, that i deal with. granted, i may not be the best negotiator and i may leave money on the table, but you know what? if i feel, that it’s a win-win for everybody, then i don’t care, if i maybe could have squeezed another 1 or 2k out of this. if the deal is good, then it can support the difference. go into the negotiation with your heart as well as your head.
just my thoughts
michaela
Re: How do you become a “people person”? - Posted by michael e. v. knight
Posted by michael e. v. knight on October 30, 2002 at 20:15:37:
hi
i have found books and tapes by Wayne Dyer (in the self help section of the bookstore) very helpful.
happy investing,
michael e. v. knight
Re: How do you become a “people person”? - Posted by $Cash$ (NV)
Posted by $Cash$ (NV) on October 30, 2002 at 19:14:49:
NJ989,
Glad to meet you.
Zig is the man. I have read and studied just about everything this man has written.
I have said on the board before I read Zig’s books, listened to his tapes for hours at a time. I substituted real estate for pots and pans, which Zig sold. I found a need ‘motivated sellers’ and I filled that need. No Guru’s, no real estate courses, no seminars and no conventions. However, I am planning on attending my first one that the Vaughan’s are putting on in Atlanta if J.P. let’s me in. A few weeks ago in a private meeting in Las Vegas I met my first Real Estate Guru face to face. He was extremely knowledgable, a gentlemen and has a sincere desire to help people become creative real estate investors. He is a great golfer, people person and killed them at the Black Jack tables.
I can not sell anything that I personally do not believe in. This I would say is the first step believe in creative real estate investing. The second step I would say is product knowledge know this industry and your investing method inside out.
OK now the people person part. When I go in a store, restaurant, anywhere there are people the first thing I look for is their name tag, which is pretty common now if they come in contact with customers. I will start a conversation using the persons name off their name tag. “Hello Jill, please put me in the back close to the kitchen I am really hungry today.” “Jill I will have a diet ice tea please.”
One of my favorite places to have meetings at is the IHOP close to where I live. I will tell you they all know me there, I know what the people who work there hobbies are, their dreams are, things that are important to them. Start interacting with everyone you come into contact with, joke with them, tell them how great the service was, how nice they look today, are you getting the picture.
People skills begin with interacting with other people not acting more important because they dig a ditch or buss a table. Get on the same level, I can talk with a bank president or meter maid with equal ease. Even Tim Fierro and Michaelahhh laugh at my Fowl Jokes.
Remember Zig knocked on doors selling his product meeting people, who knows how many people he met, shook their hands, then sold his product. Start tomorrow be sincere, Hi I’m NJ989, glad to meet you.
It will not take long to develop your people skills.
John $Cash$ Locke
Re: How do you become a “people person”? - Posted by Stacy (AZ)
Posted by Stacy (AZ) on October 30, 2002 at 17:43:03:
I could have written your post. Before I left my career to go full-time into investing, I was a manager in the engineering department at Honeywell. I’m a trained engineer, but had to learn management/people skills when I became a manager many years ago. But being a good salesman was very foreign to me, and I admit to disliking “saleman types” I ran into at furniture stores, or car lots. I had no respect for their talents…they weren’t left-brained enough for this techie, I guess.
I started to learn salesmanship via “on the job training” when I ventured into investing. It exposed me to a whole new world of negotiating and maneuvering, and also exposed my own weakness. Even now, I still struggle at times with the whole salesmanship gig. I still ask questions when I find a good salesman to help me to try to improve. By the way John Loche ($CASH$) is a good salesman, and can provide some good answers regarding selling the sizzle instead of the steak.
I don’t have a recommendation for a book or an organization, other than the old Zig-miester. I just wanted to say you’re not alone, and you get better as you do deals.
Good luck.
Go to an online book store and search for. . . - Posted by DJR in Omaha
Posted by DJR in Omaha on November 01, 2002 at 13:23:43:
“How I raised myself from a failure to success in sales” by Frank Bettger. Best book ever written on salesmanship IMHO. It’s over 80 years old and every lesson is as valid today as back then.
Re: How do you become a “people person”? - Posted by michaela-ATL
Posted by michaela-ATL on October 31, 2002 at 14:25:37:
i guess noone ever told me, that i can’t ‘wing it’, so i was pretty successful in sales. my old boss still calls me once a year to see, if i want to work for him again. i just didn’t know any better 
michaela
Right smart fella. - Posted by $Cash$ (NV)
Posted by $Cash$ (NV) on October 31, 2002 at 11:38:13:
Bryan,
Glad to meet you.
Right smart fella that Tom Hopkins. Have a presentation use it and don’t wing it. I’ll have to remember this one.
John $Cash$ Locke
Re: How do you become a “people person”? - Posted by Todd (MO)
Posted by Todd (MO) on November 01, 2002 at 17:21:17:
Hi Eric,
Actually NLP does apply in real estate situations, I have been using it for years. I don’t use it manipulatively, just creatively and to put the people at ease and to better uncover and understand what they want.
I started in real estate, then years later went through all the trainings and am now an NLP trainer as well. I’m not aware of your background or what you are referring to as to why conversational hypnosis would not be effective in real estate situations. Conversational hypnosis does not necessarily mean you are putting the people in a trance and they will do anything you want them to do. That’s more of a thing for stage hypnosis. It is more of a very light trance that helps to get at what the people really want, not just what they tell themselves they want.
I wrote a post last year that somewhat address the topic of the thread here called “This IS a people business.”, along with some reading referrals. I hope everyone finds them useful.
http://www.creonline.com/wwwboard/messages/arc_2001//arc_52/52278.html
Thanks,
Todd
Re: How do you become a “people person”? - Posted by Ronald * Starr(in No CA)
Posted by Ronald * Starr(in No CA) on October 31, 2002 at 15:53:53:
Eric–(FL)-----------------
I thank you for sharing your knowledge on this topic.
I find nothing to question, criticize, or contradict in your post. You will please… continue … to do such … good posts in the future … as you like, yes like to help people. You are thinking to yourself… “Yes, I will help people in the future” … because you want to do so.
I have not taken the time to study NPL in any depth, but I have read about 1/3 of a book on the topic and it had some interesting self-demonstrations of the princples. I think that the approach has some merit. It is interesting to me that it seems to have some close parallels “cognitive therapy.” I have been doing what I call “self-reconstruction” and digging into my inner feelings, self-talk, images, and such to change my motivations and actions. This works for me and seems to me to validate some of what the NLP people and the behavioral therapy people say.
Good Investing and Good PostingRon Starr*****
Re: alternate ego - Posted by js-Indianapolis
Posted by js-Indianapolis on October 31, 2002 at 02:22:49:
Tray, good advice.
When I was managing a telemarketing office, I had a VERY shy assistant manager. Now try being shy, and calling about 300 people a day. Guess what? It was never him on the phone, it was his alter ego. To him, it was always a totally different person making those calls. Simply a part in a play.
I suppose we all do that, a little or a lot. I’m pretty comfortable talking to most people, but have had to turn on the part of “Mr. CRE, REI, Preforeclosure extraordinaire” in talking through my first couple of deals. I suppose in time I’ll be able to act a little less, and know a little more. Til then, I hope they don’t catch onto the fact that I’m faking it.
Posted by $Cash$ (NV) on October 30, 2002 at 22:26:27:
Michaelahhh,
Somehow I can envision you laying there reading a creative real estate book alone bare on a skin rug (Oh!)I mean alone on a ‘bear skin rug’ in front of the fireplace.
Chess anyone?
$Cash$
Re: How do you become a “people person”? - Posted by LenNJ
Posted by LenNJ on October 31, 2002 at 08:26:04:
Hey $Cash$ first of all good post and good advice, would you mind mentioning the gurus name that you had spoken to? I always like to hear of who one guru considers as another respectable peer. Besides that can you also send me a link in regards to your course and the topics it covers, I didnt realize you had a course till today. thanks again.