I need an answer here - Posted by mike

Posted by John on September 06, 2009 at 04:33:13:

Not really anything weird here if you know how a bank operates.

The quick and dirty abbreviated version of it is that in a fractional reserve banking system like ours banks are allowed to lend up to 10 times the amount of money they actually have on hand. 10% of the total of all liabilities are kept in reserve as cash or a cash equivalent.

This system of leverage works great as long as everyone is paying their bills. However let assuming someone defaults and they are forced to take back an REO. Now that property is on their books however the associated loan has defaulted. In theory they are suppose to mark down the value of that defaulted loan and property to what they think they may be able to get, something which banks are currently doing all they can do to avoid. Because once you mark down that property you have to realize a loss and build up your reserves. Ideally you would sell it for cash as soon as possible to minimize the costs associated with holding that property but we are currently in a huge real estate bust and very few people have the cash hoarded up to pay all cash. If they can self finance the “sales” via providing financing they get to now get those deadbeat properties off their books and replace them with “performing” loans. As far as their books are concerned they can pretty much make the self financed sales look the same as an all cash sale, thus preserving or reducing their capital requirements. Considering that by self financing they could probably get a higher price and interest income as well, they may even make the sales look better (also helping in their comps for other properties) although in reality they are still riding that property down only now with a different borrower (whom hopefully will not default).

I need an answer here - Posted by mike

Posted by mike on August 29, 2009 at 22:08:39:

Have any of you experienced this from a bank? I have three deals im trying to
close in the next 30-45 days. My banker Ive been with for years is
gone…My only true relationship.

I walked into a bank yesterday, talked to the Executive Vice President, and
asked him an honest question… “Is your bank investing in Real Estate” and
the answer I got which I could not believe is “NO”…This was one of the top
executives who runs most of the commercial bankers…at this bank.

As we talked he said it didnt matter who you were, they were pulling in there
horns and not lending because the gov’t increased there tier 1 requirements
by 2 percent. They used to lend all kinds of real estate deals and now they
wont touch them. I have found lots of banks getting skiddish…

We own property and are trying to acquire more for Rentals…I just thought it
was very interesting and couldnt believe banks would say or do this.

So to keep the conversation going I ask him if he has any REO inventory…He
says yes…So I ask if he will finance this and he said well “Of course” we are
very motivated…So they wont loan on any other properties but they would
love to get this stuff off of the books…

Question one have any of you ran across this kind of situation? What banks
tend to be loaning for rehabs? And have any of you ever bought direct from
the banks in these types of situations? Did it go well and Did the bank give
good terms and price?

Thanks

Mike

Re: I need an answer here - Posted by Sailor

Posted by Sailor on August 31, 2009 at 19:01:30:

I use small local banks, & maintain relationships w/3 because VPs change all too frequently, as do policies. That said, I haven’t tried for any financing since Jan.

For loans under 50k you might get approval on the spot right @ the branch, no loan committee. I did that last year on a 100% loan w/just a phone call to a VP I’ve never met. If you are targeting lower middle class properties (my fave) this might still work.

Tye

Re: I need an answer here - Posted by Chi Ming

Posted by Chi Ming on August 30, 2009 at 18:23:55:

Lenders are investors, but not RE investors. They have different rules to live by and right now its very clear to all surviving lenders that RE is a good way to go out of business. There are better ways to make money, so that’s where they head. Better does not always mean higher ROI but ROI balanced off by risk of loss.

Owner Financing - Posted by JT-IN

Posted by JT-IN on August 30, 2009 at 17:36:09:

Becomes the option for purchasing in these times, when liquidity has left the building.

Banks, with their REO’s, are doing nothing more than providing owner financing, by originating a new mtg. They just happen to have the purse strings to do so, as well as either warehouse the loan or sell it in the secondary mkt.

Take advantage of the offerings for REO’s as long as the price and terms are decent. Just remember, what is decent today… may not be 6 months from now, so proceed with caution.

Re: I need an answer here - Posted by Frank Chin

Posted by Frank Chin on August 30, 2009 at 08:08:15:

Mike:

Time was 1993. The S&L crisis was in full bloom, and the Resolution Trust Corp. started taking over many S&L’s. A lot of them went under.

It was awfully hard to get a loan unless you put 25% or more down, and have supporting incomes.

Now comes along this S&L putting over 200 REO’s properties up for auction. Not only that, for the first few dozen sold, it’s sold “free and clear”, and they even give you the mortgage to buy it at 10% down.

And how about the debt/income ratios, as I’m a bit on the high side owning other rentals. Well, “don’t worry about it, because we will keep these mortgages on our books, and we don’t follow fixed formulae”, according to the banker.

So I bought the home I live in at this auction where the bank gave me the mortgage on their REO for 10% down. They also give you the mortgage with a one hour approval, on the spot if you bring your tax returns.

In 1993, banks decide how, when and where they do mortgages, after the market collapsed at the end of the 1980’s. This bank gave me a $200K mortgage at the auction, but turned me down for a refi the month before. I wanted a 7.5% 80K mortgage, refiing a 12%/80K mortgage on a property worth 200K, and was turned down. The banker worked very hard on the refi, and felt bad it was turned down. It was a six month struggle.

After I got my $200K mortgage approved for the REO at the auction, I took the paperwork, showed it to this banker, said to her "it’s strange you can’t give me a 80K mortgage after 6 months, but here they gave me $200K, with one hour approval.

I bought rentals in the early 80’s, for a little over 100K, in the early 90s was worth 250K, having dropped from 350K at it’s peak.

I wanted to lower my rates, and cash out a bit. I wanted a 150K mortgage when the houses appraised for 250K. The bank said NO, NO cash out, I’m only allowed around $110K, with them throwing in a few dollars to cover my refi fees. Problem was they were NOT doing real estate loans.

Does it make sense. NO if you’re a real estate investor. YES, if you’re a banker.

Then, as it is now, banks have different programs to handle different problems. The one part of the bank that won’t give me the $80K mortgage was suffering heavy losses. The part of the bank that gave me the $200K mortgage had to unload REO’s.

So, I don’t know if it answers your question. Yes, I’ve been there, and seen it.

Re: I need an answer here - Posted by mike

Posted by mike on September 02, 2009 at 21:32:31:

thanks for the insight…Im fighting an uphill battle with 3
deals…Hopefully I can get them financed…I need 100 percent
loans…Land rich cash poor…Its always tough…Welcome to RealEstate.

thanks again for the information

Re: I need an answer here - Posted by mike IA

Posted by mike IA on September 02, 2009 at 21:35:35:

You are definitely right…But I would assume someone has to still be
lending on REO’s and these types of properties if that is the borrowers
main business. Who knows…Thanks for the information …MIKE

Re: Owner Financing - Posted by mike ia

Posted by mike ia on September 02, 2009 at 21:38:20:

JT you have been around a while…I think you are truly right. Ive been
thinking of using this as a new strategy if I cant get banks to deal with
our current properties we have under contract, just go after their dead
assets so they can get them off the books and make them a performing
asset. Thanks again for all your insight…

Re: I need an answer here - Posted by mike ia

Posted by mike ia on September 02, 2009 at 21:44:08:

Frank Chin,

I am so glad I am not the only one who has experienced this type of
situation. Thanks for taking the time to explain your story. Its funny
how your story is similar to mine. It is beyond me how different
branches of the bank can make decisions. It just shows you if you
work hard enough and long enough RE dreams do come true. I think if
you battle through these times, and in your situation battle twice
through the bad times of the RE market, you have a true character and
longevity in this business. Thanks again for taking the time and effort
to respond to my posts, your experience gave me some insight and
thought to try to keep going and get these deals closed. I realize
sometimes it takes someone elses experiences to help you realize or
improve on your own…Thanks again for your thoughts MIKE IA