Crack in basement floor...deal killer or not? - Posted by Craig Co

import · November 26, 2002, 10:22pm

Posted by js-Indianapolis on November 28, 2002 at 02:52:16:

Too complex? It’s a phone call to two or three concrete leveling companies for free quotes. If it’s a go, it’s only a couple grand, at worst.

BTW, if you do go that route, ask what the contractor bases his prices on. I knew guys that would charge according to what they were saving you, as opposed to their time. Meaning if you had the choice of raising the house, and building a new basement, they’d charge maybe half price of that. I’ve heard stories of $5000 days, many times. If the job takes a day, you should pay no more than about $1000. Don’t let em tell you materials are expensive either. It’s powdered limestone and water, very inexpensive. Very effective though. I’d go as far as saying better than new.

import · November 26, 2002, 10:22pm

Crack in basement floor…deal killer or not? - Posted by Craig Co

Posted by Craig Co on November 26, 2002 at 23:22:12:

Hello all,

There’s about $30k in equity to be had in this SFH, give or take $5k in cosmetic fixup, however, there are some issues with cracks inside and outside of the home. In the basement there is a crack that runs the length of the room where there is a noticable difference in the floor level of about 3 inches from the highest point to the lowest point in the floor. Just imagine a miniature fault line in the floor. It’s covered with carpet, so it doesn’t look bad, but you certainly notice when walking in the room. Also, the front steps and porch have the same issue with a sloping porch and large crack that runs the length of the stairs and porch. The house was built in 1980, so this is the most it has moved in 22 years.

I’m thinking of fixing up cosmetically and reselling to a retail buyer OR selling on lease option. In your experience, how are most retail buyers going to react to this if the rest of the house is in great condition? I don’t know anyone in the cement business, so correcting this problem is last on my list. Also, I don’t know that there is enough equity here to justify fixing the issues.

Thanks for your feedback!

import · November 27, 2002, 9:17pm

Re: Crack in basement floor…deal killer or not? - Posted by Ecase

Posted by Ecase on November 27, 2002 at 22:17:53:

Well I would like to see it first to say for sure if it is a deal killer or not! But, If the concrete floor dropped 3" on one side of the crack either the earth shifted under the slab or the base under the concrete wasn’t vigin soil and sank after they poured the concrete. either way, if the footers that the basement walls sit on were not disturbed along with this floor problem your probably o.k… The footers hold the house in place not the basement floor concrete slab. Check throughout the house for stress cracks in the drywall, these cracks will indicate a strutural problem with the footers, and that IS a PROBLEM. Also, look closely at the basement walls for signs of stress cracks that go from floor to rafters this can also indicate a poor foundation. The concrete steps out front that have cracked should also have a footer under them,if the footer under these steps was not properly set-up on either compacted or virgin soil it would cause such problems, but the steps could be corrected without to much hassle. The basement floor, and I don’t know how large of an area were talking here, could be “Pumped-up” and leveled using the services of a concrete leveling company, there’s a few in every town. If you are serious about buying this property hire a contractor to give you his opinion first. Hire a good general contractor w/ a good reputation and pay the fee for his inspection, it will be worth the money spent. Don’t run from this one might be a great deal. Do your home work first! Good luck.

import · November 27, 2002, 3:53am

Re: Crack in basement floor…deal killer or not? - Posted by Bob (oh)

Posted by Bob (oh) on November 27, 2002 at 04:53:01:

Hold on !
You explain that the house is 22 years old and the cement in the basement is dropped 3 inches.
So, if I get this wrong, please correct me.
Are you nuts ?
Three inches is just as bad as 12 on a house that young. I have been in houses that are 100 years old and they look just fine. I believe what you have going on is some serious water drainage issues and if it is not addressed in the proper mannor, that half of the house could fall in.
I would check the area and see if other homes have the same type of problem first thing.
Second is to contact a pro basement water proofer and get an estimate. While he’s there, pick his brain and see if he would know what would cause it.
I belive you would be getting into some serious money to repair it. A simple patch job would show that you had some idea there was something wrong and that you were trying to hide it to cause a sale. This alone could be a court issue you dont even want to get involved with.
OK, Sorry for being so blunt but, I can not express enought how important this issue is above what your knowledge is.
After you get the information I explained, that should give you an idea for a bid. However, this will take some time and you will also need to include the mortgage payments as a loss while the repairs are being done.
Good luck !
Remember : Due dilligence is your best investment.
Bob(OH)

import · November 26, 2002, 11:42pm

Re: Crack in basement floor…deal killer or not? - Posted by Bob H

Posted by Bob H on November 27, 2002 at 24:42:27:

Craig,

If you plan on retailing the property, I think you also need to anticipate fixing the concrete/structural issues. The CO market is way to soft right now to expect a retail sale w/ the the problems you describe - there are simply too many other choices in the marketplace. To a lesser degree, the same holds true even if you plan to L/O or OWC.

Determine your repair costs and adjust your offer accordingly.

Good luck!

import · November 27, 2002, 9:17am

And that’s why I LOVE this site! - Posted by Craig CO

Posted by Craig CO on November 27, 2002 at 10:17:47:

Thanks for your feedback, gentlemen. I couldn’t imagine succeeding in this business without having a network of pros to turn to. Since I’ve only done a handful of deals thus far, it’s obvious that I have a LOT to learn.

Thanks and have a Happy Thanksgiving!

import · November 27, 2002, 9:59am

Hold on, it might not be that bad. - Posted by js-Indianapolis

Posted by js-Indianapolis on November 27, 2002 at 10:59:02:

I owned my own concrete business for almost 5 years. This may or may not be a water problem. I’ve seen slabs crack and settle more than three inches in just the first year. It doesn’t happen just from water, and assuming so might cause you to walk from what could be a nice deal.

I could go into 10 pages of why concrete cracks, and how it reacts to a freeze/thaw cycle in various climates. There are people who have obtained a Ph.D. in concrete technology. I’m very serious, a Ph.D…

Although I do not have a Ph.D., my company worked exclusively in concrete repair and beautification. One service that we contracted out was leveling. These companies might be called “mud jackers” or just concrete leveling companies. They will level anything from a sidewalk, to a whole house. They can even raise an entire two story chimney straight up. I’ve seen one raised over a foot.

The process is simple. They drill holes in the floor, and pump a limestone mixture under the slab, filling in any voids. It’s quick and inexpensive. Also, anyone who is worth a darn in the business will guarantee their work. So will it work, for your situation?

I can’t say, as I haven’t seen the slab. Although just assuming that you’ve got serious water problems is not correct. You might, and might not. Who knows what happened the day the concrete was poured. Maybe before the back fill around the walls, water washed out some of the base they were working on. Maybe they didn’t tamp that side of the base well enough, and the settling is just the base compacting under the weight. Maybe the crew was a serious bunch of idiots, and didn’t even put a base under that half of the basement. I’ve seen worse workmanship. It’s really not uncommon at all.

You need to keep in mind that anyone can pour concrete, and make it last long enough to walk off the job. As far as a guarantee on a new pour, there’s an unfunny joke in the concrete contractor business. Everyone says, “Sure it’s guaranteed…guaranteed to crack.” As not funny as that is, it’s the truth, it does, and will crack, guaranteed. It’s getting it to crack in the right places, and not having it settle that is the tough part. Although, if it does happen, it can be fixed.

See if a concrete pumping company is willing to warrantee squeezing a giant limestone base underneath it, and getting it level. If they say it’ll work, and put it in writing, I’d be confident you’ve got a solution. We used a company called A1 Concrete Leveling here. They sell franchises around the country, so you might have one in your area. Free quotes, so it won’t hurt you any to get their opinion.

Best of luck to you, let us know how it goes.

import · November 27, 2002, 5:28pm

Re: Hold on, it might not be that bad. - Posted by JD

Posted by JD on November 27, 2002 at 18:28:52:

I agree. I have done similar things. Fortunately this type of repair is too complex for most investors.