Those days are over - Posted by louis

Posted by JimKC on July 09, 2001 at 23:30:09:

Louis: On July 29 I took over control of a house worth $130m in KC area. Would be maybe $290m in New York. 3br 2ba 2100 sq ft. 20yrs old. Clean, no work to be done. Today I leased it w/option to buy in two years at $147m. Next friday when we complete paperwork (3 docs) I will receive $5000 cash. When new tenant/buyer moves in on Aug 1 I will receive $1425 rent, netting $125 per mo. And I tell them I’m not your landlord I’m your banker. My seller has none of my money (or anybody eles’s) They just left me the payment book. I guarantee you there are sellers who want and need to walk away from their nightmares and will if you can find them. My wife found these folks by sending them a post card. She found them in the local KC fsbo magazine. da So much for Realtors.

Those days are over …here - Posted by louis

Posted by louis on July 09, 2001 at 22:40:16:

I have been studying creative real estate and establishing a good credit history (fico 650)for a couple of years now and for the past 6 months i’ve been searching for a property to rehab and resell unconventionaly since my income was only 57000.00 last year and i really don’t have a down payment since i would use my saved money to purchase whatever materials i would need for my project.
also i should let you know i rehab homes daily as i work for a reconstruction business and i wow people daily with my skill but today i spoke with a realtor that discouraged me . She said that the creative real estate days are over in my area Staten Island New York . she told me it was a sellers market and to get in on anything worth my while i would have to come to the table with cash and be ready to pay over the asking price !
could this be true ?
was all my research for nothing ?
i thought about trying to purchase in another state but i would’nt know the area like i know my own…
is there a way to entice a seller to sell to me with out the cash deal they are looking for ?
i apreciate any suggestions

Probably not over, but… - Posted by Alex Gurevich, TX

Posted by Alex Gurevich, TX on July 10, 2001 at 16:35:45:

… you should make that determination on your own.

I’ll probably speak to the contrary of what others have implied here: “don’t listen to the real estate agent, the deals are available in any market and yours too, you just need to learn how to find them.”

In theory, and in most cases in practice this is correct. You shouldn’t listen to what the agent is telling you. Instead, develop your own understanding of what’s going on in your market. Get busy, get going, talk to a good number of FSBO owners, make offers, see if you can negotiate something there.

Check the realities of your market with the data from MLS:

  1. How many houses are there for sale in your target areas? A very few or great many?
  2. How long do they stay on the market on the average? If the average time on the market is under 30 days - you really have a hot sellers market. If, on the other hand, you have a lot of homes on the market listed for over 90 days and a lot of “expired” listings, you are NOT in the hot sellers’ market. There should be plenty of opportunities for you to get good deals.
  3. Are there a lot of foreclosures in your county monthly? Get the count of foreclosures from real estate companies, or special services companies selling pre- and post- foreclosure listings to investors. You can find them at the courthouse, deed records dept.
  4. Are there a lot of VA, HUD homes listed for bidding weekly? What is the ratio of HUD list prices and winning bids? Find an authorized broker and get the stats of past bids for the last 2-3 months. If a number of listings is selling quite a bit below list prices it’s an indication of opportunities in HUD/VA foreclosures.

Bottom line, get your own research on the state of your market done - then you’ll know if it’s a sellers’ market, indeed.

If you find you are in the sellers’ market, you may consider relocating to an area where buying homes is not that hard. If you are a beginner with no resources or connections, a red-hot sellers’ market could slow you down by several years.

I know this from personal experience. In ‘91 when I got started in r.e., I was in the S.F.Bay Area. It so happened the market there was going through the peak, with multiple offers exceeding the asking price. It was a totally sellers’ market. For the first 9 months I made well over 100 offers on houses and didn’t get anything accepted. Cash at discounted prices or seller financing was of NO interest at all to any of those sellers. At least 30% of the offers I made were on REOs. Banks weren’t negotiating either.

I wasn’t willing to give up on real estate that easily, so I made a decision to relocate to a place where the prices were lower, the market was slower and it would be easier for me (a beginner with no resources) to make it happen. I did relocate shortly thereafter and bought my 1st home in less than a month after that. Then shortly another one and another one…

The point is, research your market on your own, try to make it happen where you are. If you feel you are banging your head against the stone wall, don’t kill yourself and don’t delay your progress. Move to a different place where it might be a little easier to get started. But do get started.

Louis Read JohnBoy’s Classic - Posted by SueC

Posted by SueC on July 10, 2001 at 15:01:36:

Louis, I read a variation of this post by JohnBoy once a long time ago, and printed it out, and read it, and re-read it. It has been an incredible motivator for me. He has posted it in many variations, and thankfully now JP has posted it under Money Making Ideas. It is a classic, and explains just what you need to do. Note that “listen to your realtor” is NOT part of his post!

Good luck and happy investing

Sue Caskey

Listen to those who you wish to emmulate - Posted by JT - IN

Posted by JT - IN on July 10, 2001 at 12:22:52:


This lecturing from this agent may be right, in the majority of cases, but not all cases!

What about the sellers that need to sell TODAY. Can this agent produce a buyer today, that knows the way to help a motivated seller, the way that you can, if you believe you can.

The opportunities may be fewer (there) today, than in another times, but they are not nonexistent. You just need to find the way to get at them. I assume that people in your area are still getting divorced, dying and having other family/financial tramas, and this is what you can help them solve; not the agent.

Be a “Bumble Bee”, which by the way, can’t fly! Did you know that? Physics majors have proven that a “Bumble Bee” can’t fly, because of their body weight and mass, relative to their wing mass/strength. So be a friend of nature, and the next time that you see a “Bumble Bee” flying, tell him to land, before he hurts himself, cause the physics majors, (and in your case, the Agent), have determined that it is impossible for this to be done!

Be the best “Bumble Bee” that you can be, and give that Agent a Physics lesson, or two!


Re: Those days are over …here - Posted by Richard Coccodrilli, Jr

Posted by Richard Coccodrilli, Jr on July 10, 2001 at 10:33:35:

DON’T EVER believe a Realtor when it comes to this type of conversation, they have no vested interest in your well being and feel that you in fact are taking away from their available market where they can make the $$. This “newbie” (2 properties) has found his deals on the VA site and an internet auction site (I won the heated auction without ever even seeing the property), the banks just want to get rid of these places and you benefit (I purchased it for 40% of the asking price)…they are out there.

Good Luck

Fellow Newbie

Re: Those days are over …here - Posted by M.garv(IL)

Posted by M.garv(IL) on July 10, 2001 at 10:04:07:

Louis , here is another Idea. I gaurantee that if you look in your local newspaper that you will definately see ads that say WE BUY HOUSES and other ones simalar to that. You need to call these people and let them know you are looking for properties for rehab and to put you on there buyers list. With alot of these ads the people behind them are just looking to buy properties low and flip them to a rehabber at a small profit. THis is what they do for a living and they do this all day. Another important note is that these people are most likely in the creative side of the business and understand the language you are trying to speak.Alot of times they will be creative about doing deals with you and if they are not they most likely will deal an a regular basis with someone than can get you the funding you need. Give it a try
Mike Garvin (IL)

Re: Those days are over …here - Posted by Carey_PA

Posted by Carey_PA on July 10, 2001 at 09:30:47:


Don’t let your realtor get you down. Realtors only KNOW market value. They’re use to dealing with “normal” buyers and “normal” sellers and that’s IT!

For the most part, realtors ARE CLUELESS!!! But they are an excellent tool to utilize!!! (Just make sure you know they are clueless about creative financing and use them to get mls listings and property values and tax info…etc)

Take Steve Cooks advice and educate yourself on finding good deals and GO GET 'EM!


It will never work where you live… - Posted by SCook85

Posted by SCook85 on July 10, 2001 at 08:40:25:


It will never work where you live if you believe that it doesn’t work. Going to another state won’t change things. The first realtor who tells you that you can’t do it there will force you to get up and go to another state.

You need to get over this. Do you think that you are in the only sellers market in the country? Do you think your realtor even knows anything about creative real estate? Is everyone else who comes to this site posting their successes just living in a better state? (State of mind maybe)

What you were told by your realtor is the kind of thing that I and my successful real estate investing friends use to motivate ourselves. Not to discourage us. If your realtor would have come to you and said “sure, subject to deals work all the time here- I do them, my brother does them, my neighbor does them, my aunt and uncle, my best friend, and the other people in my office all do them” then I might be concerned. The secret would be out and you would have a ton of competition.

Regardless of what type of investing you choose to approach (I’m assuming rehabbing and retailing since you are able to rehab yourself) there are deals out there. Now you just need to educate yourself on how to find those deals.


Hurry up - Posted by Tim Jensen

Posted by Tim Jensen on July 10, 2001 at 06:39:05:


Your Realtor is right you better hurry up and buy everything you can …NOT!

The reason the realtor says that is because she/he can’t do it. Plain and simple.


Re: Those days are over …here - Posted by wayne

Posted by wayne on July 10, 2001 at 01:53:47:

Don’t by the bs spout out by that realtor. Of course they want you to think that creative real estate is over, after all, all deals done directly with the owners is one less deal they can get their commission on.
You need to go and find the deal’s. Ask a title officer to compose a list for you of out of state owners, then send them a letter, maybe you will find one that inherited the property or has been so long removed from the area they really have no clue of what the actual value of the home is. As you are driving about doing your daily business, look for homes that are somewhat run down, (long grass that needs mowing, peeling paint etc.) you will find these homes, they are in every area, then just simply approach the owner and you will eventually find one that has no money to rehab the home and will jump at the chance of getting out from under it. Then simply rehab it and sell it, and if you dont have any money to purchase it, then make a deal with a lease option, and get some renters in their to make the property self-sustaining. Otherwise you can structure a deal where if they have no money then you will do a contract for deed, rehab it and then pay him a set amount say 40k for the property plus 10% of the difference in the sale price. They will jump at the chance to make even more money than the house is worth the way it sits. And the attractive thing for you is that you only have to pay for the materials to rehab it since you do the work yourself. And if everything falls apart the only thing you are out is your rehab money (and unrealized profit)…make a stipulation that the owner will reimburse you for any materials should he try to back out.

A month ago I was scared of rei, although I have not done a deal yet, I am comfortable approaching any owner and talking about rehab opportunities and/or lease options. Although I will start with contract for deeds until I learn more about getting the deeds, and placing properties in trusts. Until then, I do understand l/o and contract for deeds, and am certain my due diligence is satisfactory to analyze a properties property potential.

Be persistent, dont give up!!!


Re: Those days are over …here - Posted by Brian H

Posted by Brian H on July 09, 2001 at 23:43:08:

You need to be PERSISTENT!!

Do not let that realtor steal your DREAMS!!

Your realtor does not know creative real estate investing. He or she only KNOWS what they were taught in real estate school. That is not much at all.

It might be a sellers market in Staten Island. You need to remember there are MOTIVATED SELLERS out there. You need to find them. You need to let EVERYONE KNOW you buy all types of properties. You need to pass out business cards to EVERYONE you meet.

You need to be an AGGRESSIVE marketer of your business to succeed.

The only way to FAIL is to QUIT!!

Now go find a deal and come back with a success story and your attitude will change.

Have a prosperous day!!