Nobody listens . . . - Posted by Lette

Posted by Rob FL on October 21, 1998 at 19:34:47:

great post

Nobody listens . . . - Posted by Lette

Posted by Lette on October 20, 1998 at 20:16:55:

I’m doing everything you guys tell me. The only problem is, I’m not meeting up with any “creative-minded” people. I met a mortgage broker yesterday who gave me an application to have me pre-approved for a loan. He explained however that it would be alot easier to know how much money they could lend me if I had a specific property to purchase. I understand this perfectly. He also asked if I had any of my own capital. I repeated what I’ve learned - “I plan to use OPM”. Today I spoke to another person who said that to be able to put 20% down would make me alot more powerful. Nobody seems to understand the creative side of real estate. Or I’m probably just dealing with closed minded people. They tell me things like, it would be a good idea if I had some cash to work with. “Oh well - I don’t. So either help me or be quiet.” I never actually say that. Those are just my thoughts.

But I’ll keep trying. I know there’s got to be a nonconventional broker out there some where who’s willing to help me with no money down financing. I know they can’t all be residing in Kansas and California.

Thanks for listening. As always - all comments are so appreciated.

Privtae money plus Seller fin = profit . . . - Posted by Alex Gurevich, TX

Posted by Alex Gurevich, TX on October 23, 1998 at 09:37:09:


There’s been a lot of philosophical responses to your post all of which are right in general: know what you are looking for and the money won’t be a problem. BTW, most likely, on your first few transactions it’s easier to get the money anywhere, but the mortgage community.

You’ll always make money when you are buying a property cheap, cheap, cheap. Depending on the economy, it may not be as easy as it sounds, especially in the beginning. For example, out of about a dozen properties I bought this year only 1 was a true bargain, 40 cents on a $. Same last year. The rest of them are properties purchased at relatively small discount 10-20% but on excellent terms, no money out of pocket,
taking over existing loans with low interest/payments.

I’d like to turn in a bit of a practical advice.
Here’s a profitable technique with plenty of private money easily available to finance it. This will put some cash in your pocket and create a nice monthly cash flow too.

In the older areas there are lots of homes that are paid for. Some of them have been on the market for a while. Get several signs in those areas and you’ll hear from some of those homeowners frustrated with their realtors. On house listed with a realtor, say for 80K some owner will be interested in accepting about $65-67K without commissions, FHA and other closing costs, etc. Offer them 1/2 cash now and 1/2 half cash later, when your buyer qualifies for new 3rd party financing (3-5-7 years). No payments and/or interest on seller’s 2nd mortgage. Now, advertise in your newspaper’s financial section for $40K 1-st private loan at 15%, 5 years, 50% Loan to value. You WILL get calls. At closing you will pocket about 4-5K after closing costs, your monthly payments interest only on 40K will be $500. Sell the property for $82.5K with 2.5K down owner financed contract for deed at 10.5% for 4.5 years. You’ll collect another $2.5K cash plus incoming payments Principal and interst will be $731. That’s $231 cash flow for the next 5 years.

Offering a price close to what the seller would net if (s)he were to pay commissions and closing costs and negotiating favorable terms is not as hard as trying to go for a kill on the price. In this example, it’s highly unlikely that you could get this property for $40K cash outright. But the seller might be in the position to get $33K cash now and wait for a few years for another 30K from you.

All you have to do is ask.

Re: Nobody listens . . . - Posted by Mr Donald (NORVA)

Posted by Mr Donald (NORVA) on October 21, 1998 at 17:35:14:

As Rush Limbaugh would say…


to JPiper.

Couldn’t have said it better. :slight_smile:

Mr Donald

Re: Nobody listens . . . - Posted by JPiper

Posted by JPiper on October 21, 1998 at 16:42:30:


As I read your posts, this one and others, a few things strike me that I would like to comment on.

First, in order to effectively perform in the real estate investment business you need to get your knowledge level to a certain point. I get the impression that you aren’t there…and perhaps that’s why “nobody listens”.

Here’s an example. If you told me today that I had to go buy a property today with “no money down” I might be hard pressed to do so. If you told me as an investor that I should go talk to mortgage brokers until I find one that would provide 100% financing, I would say that would not be possible. Now perhaps I could find an owner who would owner finance me without me putting up a dime…but that’s like searching for a needle in a haystack. They might be there, but whether you can find them is another question. And certainly if you do, you better have the knowledge to persuade them to take this particular risk with you.

On the other hand, if you told me to go buy a property that required no money out of my pocket, now we have a different animal. Maybe I could find a property that I could tie up with a contract at a significant discount to it’s market value, that an investor WITH CASH could buy. Perhaps I could assign my contract to this investor, and pocket an assignment fee. Did the property require cash?? Yes. Did the property require YOUR cash?? No.

Now let’s talk about another issue. Let’s talk about what I would call “stance”. Perhaps another way of saying “stance” would be to say “are you real?” If the way you present yourself to people includes the fact that you will only look at properties at certain times when you can borrow a car…your “stance” is extremely low. Personally, I wouldn’t deal with you because I would not consider you “real” and able to perform. On the other hand if you said to me, “I’m quite busy right now with some other deals, the earliest I could look at your property would be this weekend”…I might have a different attitude. What if you followed this by saying “If I see what I would like, I would be prepared to make an offer”. Now my attitude regarding whether you’re “real” is starting to skyrocket.

What all this comes down to is your knowledge level, your stance, whether people think you are a real buyer, or whether they believe you’re a tire kicker that’s going to waste their time.

If you’re looking for “creative” people who are somehow going to provide you with a situation that you can walk into with no cash…forget it. What does a creative person need you for if he truly has found a situation that needs no cash? The person who needs to be creative is YOU. Then you go out and find situations that are such that by exercising your creativity you are able to structure a deal that enables you to buy and then resell without using your own cash. This takes knowledge…and stance.

I would suggest that you do some studying. I would further suggest that you work on your “stance”. Give some thought to what people see when you present yourself.

Finally, I would try to develop a couple of techniques that I knew inside and out. I would then try to implement those techniques. Rather than to get 10 different opinions on what you need to be doing, and then head 10 different directions, create some narrower focus for yourself, with ideas that you know backwards and forwards. Later, when you have experience, you can expand your focus.

Knowledge, stance, and focus. Think about it.


Re: Nobody listens . . .I Do - Posted by Leo Mysky

Posted by Leo Mysky on October 21, 1998 at 12:20:53:

If your in Illinois call me 815-886-0122
Or e-mail me.

Re: Nobody listens . . . - Posted by Kevin(OK)

Posted by Kevin(OK) on October 21, 1998 at 10:27:21:

You need to generate cash first! To do this, find wholesale investors (RE investment clubs, auctions, tax lien sales, etc.), ask them what their criteria for houses is. Some will want rehabs, others burned out properties, others will want pre-foreclosures. Next, find the deals they need. Do this by driving neighborhoods looking for the tell-tale signs (grass not mowed, trash, vacant, etc.). Find the homeowner, sign a contract wholesale, and sell to one of your investors wholesale. You may only make a few thousand $$ off of these deals, but it is more than you are making now. And if you make a deal, donate 20% to charity. It is a great motivator. My next goal is to make enough on my next deal to feed 200 people for Thanksgiving. Time is short, so I need to go find a deal. Good Luck!


Re: Nobody listens . . . - Posted by Sheik

Posted by Sheik on October 21, 1998 at 07:48:02:


I have read most of your posts. I have been meaning
to reply but I always put it off. You will see why

What I see (and I may be wrong) is that whenever
someone suggests something e.g. “You should make
ALL CASH offers!”, you immediately run out and
do just that.

Actually, that’s good. But in my opinion you need to
see this whole business from the bigger picture - how
everything (flipping, l/o, rehab, paper, owner
financing etc.) works together.

In my opinion you need to learn (more) the mechanics
of creative RE and how to adapt it to a specific
situation. If you run around saying the things you’ve
been saying to brokers you are sure to come off as a
"wanabe investor". Of course, You don’t want that.

Buy a few courses, reread the How To articles, get
the mechanics down and then attempt to deal. You want
to come off as a professional who knows what
she(?) is doing.

If this post seems harsh, I apologise. I have been
meaning to reply to one of your posts for a while but
I didn’t want to sound harsh.

Please do not be discourage - it took me close to
1.5 yrs to do my first deal but that’s due
primarily to own personal shortcomings (Yes, I was
scared stiff). But even I did it.


PS I am also from NY (Long Island)

Re: Nobody listens . . . - Posted by The Baze

Posted by The Baze on October 21, 1998 at 07:16:31:

IMHO, you need to quit trying to decorate a cake that isn’t yet baked. In other words, go find a motivated seller and offer to solve his problem. Once you have that done, if the deal is good enough, the money will be there. I’m a firm believer in letting the details work themselves out while I deal w/ the important stuff. Sure, you need to have a mtg broker, a title company, an appraiser, and all, but I’d rather have a property first. Then I can find all that other stuff.

Tom Bazley

Talking to deaf ears - Posted by Brandi (TX)

Posted by Brandi (TX) on October 21, 1998 at 24:13:58:

You aren’t talking to the right people. The key to creative financing and no $ down is finding a flexible seller. Present to the seller how you want to buy their property - if they take it Great! If not - NEXT!

If you have absolutely no cash or credit, try to find a property where the owner will finance no $ down or do a lease option. Another option would be to tie up a property with a contract - and find a new buyer to sell it to before you close!

Your not listening - Posted by Kevin

Posted by Kevin on October 20, 1998 at 21:36:53:

go read some of the articles posted here
if you have no money DON’T GO TO A MORTGAGE BROKER
there are many other ways to make a purchase

Re: Nobody listens . . . - Posted by Milton

Posted by Milton on October 20, 1998 at 21:34:35:

Your looking in thre wrong place,look to your motivated seller,then come back here and tell us something different.

Re: Nobody listens . . . - Posted by Jeff(MA)

Posted by Jeff(MA) on October 20, 1998 at 20:28:31:

The way to “make it” in real estate is to borrow other people’s money (OPM), but don’t borrow it all from the same person!

Don’t give up!

I really appreciate it . . . - Posted by Lette

Posted by Lette on October 22, 1998 at 12:49:41:

THANKS a million for helping me get through the newbie jitters. I’m confident that before long, I too will be able to contribute to this site.

Good advice for all newbies! - Posted by Shellie Hormann

Posted by Shellie Hormann on October 22, 1998 at 04:22:15:

Thanks for the great post. Being a newbie myself, I appreciate good pointers like this. Thanks again!


Re: Nobody listens . . . - Posted by ChuckD

Posted by ChuckD on October 21, 1998 at 23:53:32:


I don’t know if this will help, But JPiper has a very good point about your stance. I believe you need to delvelop confidence in your knowledge and yourself before others will have confidence in you.

Sue and I are just starting, and given our current situation have determined that L/O is the best way to go for us. As such, we are developing all the information we can pertaining to this speciality, so that when we speak with someone we can be confident in what we are saying.

Also, I don’t think you should be afraid to say “I don’t know” if something strange comes up, followed by “I’ll find out and get back to you”. This should give the impression that you are a person who deals straight with others. Never try to BS someone.

Part of our starting plan is that we have set a goal to have done two L/Os by the end of the year. This helps to keep us focused.

Sorry for the length of this.

Best of luck,


Re: Nobody listens . . . - Posted by JohnBoy

Posted by JohnBoy on October 21, 1998 at 19:39:34:


I wish you would really consider writing that book!!!

Nice post!